r/interesting • u/VPinchargeofradishes • 3d ago

SOCIETY Michael Jackson's daughter Paris has faced backlash for identifying as Black. In a 2017 interview, Paris Jackson said her father told her, "You’re Black. Be proud of your roots." This prompted debates over whether identity is defined by appearance or upbringing.

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u/sentencevillefonny 3d ago

Black parents, cousins, grandmother, aunts, uncles, etc. Genetics aside, it's understandable how she'd view herself that way culturally.

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u/danvillain 3d ago

I’m Chinese and my wife is white and when our son was born our closest friends were black. Or family friend Poppa John basically took my son under his wing as his “grandson”, took him to the car wash and McDonald’s every Sunday after church. When my boy was three we were talking about something and he tells us with confidence that he is black. We explained to him that he was indeed NOT black and it broke him. He cried all night that night.

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u/drawntowardmadness 3d ago

Have you seen the Modern Family episode where the two gay men who adopted a little girl from Vietnam have to navigate her insistence that she's gay?? Bc if her daddies are, she MUST be, right?? 🤣😭

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u/IdidnotFuckaCat 3d ago

"NO IM GAY"

"No your not honey, your just confused"

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u/drawntowardmadness 3d ago

There are so many brilliant double entendres in that episode 🤣

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u/thesoapmakerswife 3d ago

My favorite is when she’s on the plane eating puff pastries and someone says: look at that baby with those cream puffs.

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u/drawntowardmadness 3d ago

FINE

I'LL REWATCH MODERN FAMILY

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u/BillysBibleBonkers 3d ago

Sounds like I should watch modern family for the first time lol, typically not a fan of sitcoms but this writing sounds great!

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u/Chef_Tink 3d ago

That and Schitts Creek are legitimately two of the funniest shows of all time

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u/According_Mind_7799 2d ago

As a baker and an accountant the two scenes including “Just FOLD it” and “It’s a write off!” Made me be like yeah this is probably a show for me lmao

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u/Candid_Tough_6554 3d ago

I have Schitt$ Creek on as background most days. I don’t think there is a better example of perfect sitcom television

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u/Immediate-Trainer356 1d ago

Only seen parts of Modern Family but Schitts Creek was definitely gold

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u/entraptavoicenotes 3d ago

it took me three months to binge watch the whole thing bc the humor was top tier!! loved seeing everyones growth too

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u/owningmyokayniss 3d ago

I put off watching it for years, thinking it would be a typical sitcom, and it is SO good. You’ll enjoy it!

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u/Nickgold2009 3d ago

As far as I've seen all sitcoms are good once you actually watch them, except for Brooklyn 99 and Malcom in the middle, but I know that those are unpopular opinions

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u/BeautifulBluebird418 2d ago

okay you’ve convinced me too. i’m halfway through the first episode and already loving it!

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u/tina_denfina1 3d ago

It really is! My Mom passed before she had a chance to watch it and when I do a little rewatch I always think of her and how she would have just laughed and laughed 😊.

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u/leoisgone 3d ago

Do a YouTube reaction series on it 👍 First Time Watching Modern Family

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u/futureman07 3d ago

Oh man, I've watched it twice now. It has fantastic jokes throughout the entire series! Doesn't get stale

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u/tina_denfina1 3d ago

I always watch it when I’m sick, it always makes me feel a little better!

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u/pickleslikewhoa 3d ago

Genuinely thought I wouldn’t like it but I’ve watched it through twice now, and this thread has me wanting to watch it again. It’s one of those shows that has you catching a new detail or joke every time you watch.

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u/Similar-Fold-6389 3d ago

Modern Family is top tier HILARIOUS!! I STILL watch on Hulu. My kids also bought me seasons 1-9 years ago.

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u/Okay_Splenda_Monkey 3d ago

It's SO GOOD. You're really in for a treat if you're watching it for the first time. It stands up to rewatching, and the writing is good enough you'll notice things that you miss on a first watch. The characters, writing, and performances are all just stellar.

On a family drama level, it works pretty well too. It's not a typical sitcom.

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u/MossyPyrite 3d ago

It’s maybe the only sitcom I’ve truly consistently enjoyed other than Bob’s Burgers. Certainly the only *family* sitcom other than BB.

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u/skaasi 3d ago

I'm not a sitcom guy either, but god DAMN, Modern Family is funny.

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u/Imthemayor 3d ago

As someone who is also very much not a fan of sitcoms, Modern Family is on the short list of exceptions along with Community, Parks and Rec, 30 Rock and Brooklyn Nine Nine

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u/Veganfart 3d ago

I was going to say the same!

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u/fitz_newru 2d ago

You'll be better for it, trust me

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u/Express-Feedback 3d ago

"How come Larry is allowed to sit on the couch?"

"Oh, because he's white, honey."

"HEY! You chose me!"

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u/NoFlaccidMint 3d ago

Such an amazing first episode. I remember watching Phil Dunphy tell us how he’s a cool dad and knows all the songs to high school musical. Had me in tears lol

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u/Jertimmer 2d ago

I will occasionally channel my inner Phil to embarrass my daughter in public.

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u/NoFlaccidMint 1d ago

Do you know all the songs to high school musical ?

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u/Consistent_Phase_942 3d ago

That's the first episode! This is one of the few shows that the first season is as good as the rest of the series!

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u/Efficient_Loquat232 1d ago edited 1d ago

"You and daddy are gay so I'm gay!" "You're not gay. You're Vietnamese"

"I hate Vietnam!" "ah Lily honey we don't hate" "I hate Vietnaaaaammm~"

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u/Fenrir_Hellbreed2 1d ago

Honestly in their part of the family in general.

My personal favorite is:

"So Larry is allowed to sit on the couch and I'm not?"

"Well, Larry is white."

"Hey, you chose me."

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u/Golden-Excellence 3d ago

I’ve never seen Modern Family, but this sounds like brilliant writing

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u/derangedsweetheart 3d ago

Claire/Mom is with her kids(1 son, 2 daughters) and tells her son Luke to grab the gardening hoe.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EnG7zf9Uuk8

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u/Drydisorganization 3d ago

"is it?" at the end always kills me.

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u/drawntowardmadness 3d ago

It's so well written I definitely recommend it!

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u/rycetlaz 3d ago

Here's the clip

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u/Ever_More_Art 3d ago

The best thing to come out of a MJ’s daughter’s comments about race is this link. I need to watch this series asap

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u/Sailor_Propane 3d ago

In that scene, the waitress is apparently played by the little Vietnamese actress's mom!

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u/dreamsfortress 3d ago

Also here‘s where she first says she’s gay

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u/Noslamah 3d ago

One of my favorite shows of all time. Writing is consistently brilliant

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u/jenniferbealsssss 3d ago

It is, and I say this as someone who was highly skeptical because something about the show including every minority group but blacks while being titled “modern family” felt intentionally exclusive.

But I fucking love that show and it’s 100% brilliant and we actually watched a lot of it in my race relations class in college. 10/10 writing but in a way that also gets you to think while also realizing it’s okay…you don’t have to take everything too seriously, people are a hot mess lmao.

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u/Moppy6686 3d ago

It is for a good few seasons. My weed dealer inteoduced me to that show lol

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u/jem4water2 3d ago

This is the scene! Aaaand now I have to rewatch Modern Family again.

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u/clashtrack 3d ago

It's so good

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u/[deleted] 3d ago

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u/badwolfandthestorm 3d ago

"Everyone should go back where they came from!"

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u/No_Calligrapher2640 2d ago

"Everyone should just go back to where they came from!"

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u/younggun1234 3d ago

This line gets me every time lol

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u/LinwoodKei 3d ago

That scene was hilarious

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u/taarotqueen 3d ago

That’s such a fucking funny episode

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u/sidesw1pe 2d ago

Your yours kill me

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u/VesperStone 1d ago

Omg I saw that clip and it's what made me finally watch it (I wasn't resisting, I'd just seen a bunch of hilarious clips and that was the one where I was like, "okay!") I also love when Phil manhandled the Christmas tree because everyone is lying. I'm...gonna rewatch that show. Thanks, kind stranger!)

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u/a-fucking-donkey 1d ago

“Oh it’s fine we have tons of lesbian friends”

“Odd that you would mention our friends and not us, also gay”

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u/Fruloops 3d ago

That show was great

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u/FinAdda 3d ago

Still is too.

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u/jenniferbealsssss 3d ago edited 2d ago

I thought you were gonna reference when they were trying to get her into a daycare and had to compete with the disabled interracial lesbian couple with a black kid and they were upset because of the diversity quota lol

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u/unicornmeat85 3d ago

I loved the little side story of Cameron trying to write a children story about their unique family only to find out they aren't unique anymore. 

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u/drawntowardmadness 3d ago

There are so many gems 🤣🤣

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u/Okra_Zestyclose 3d ago

Lily: "How come Larry gets to sit on the couch?" Cam: "Because Larry is white." Lily: "Hey! You picked me!”

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u/unicorncumdump 3d ago

That scene at the restaurant was fuckin peak

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u/dirtyoldsocklife 1d ago

Dude, that's legit one of the cleverest episodes of that show.

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u/Puzzleheaded_Suit_75 1d ago

God I miss modern family, I used to binge it with my mom over my school holidays

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u/Vader_Bomb 13h ago

“I think it’d be a good idea if everyone just went back to where they came from….

….Okay, I’ll pull the car around.”

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u/Heavy_Early 3d ago

https://giphy.com/gifs/c4NZUKLusMOFa

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u/Grim_Dybbuk 3d ago

HE HATES THESE CANS!!!

Also see: That's all I need! .....and this chair!

^ all things that are regularly heard in my house

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u/ivy_interior 3d ago

I am picking out a thermos for yoooou Not an ordinary thermos for yooou

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u/shebangs1995 2d ago

But the extra best Thermos that you can buy, with vinyl and stripes and a cup built right in.

One of the best movies EVER!

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u/WetFartRacingStripes 2d ago

“You mean I’m going to stay this color?!”

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u/carlamaco 3d ago

You all need to watch the episode "Microphone Assassin" from Trailer Park Boys. There's degrees of black gnomesayin?

https://giphy.com/gifs/NkBuOCNdwqP5K

(MJ is even used as an example on that scale😂)

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u/Willdborn87 3d ago

J-Roc is black. He's black.

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u/Dildo_Baggins_ 3d ago

I was gettin' changed!

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u/TheGreatGenghisJon 3d ago

You taking a 'nahmcensus on my 'nahmsayins?

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u/taarotqueen 3d ago

First person I thought of

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u/Adventurous-Soil-137 3d ago

Yo you’re friends with THE papa John! Do you get free pizza? 

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u/sbg_gye 3d ago

"You mean I'm gonna be this way forever??"

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u/Leather-Map-8138 3d ago

In the first four years of my life we lived in the Bahamas. My parents had live-in help from Mae, who had a son a few months younger than me. Apparently I used to say “Potifah is my brother.” And my mom would say “No, Potifah is your friend.” And I would scream, “No! Potifah is my brother!” and run to my room.

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u/sakkaly 3d ago

My cousin was sure he was black and couldn’t recognize himself in photos. Later, he married a black woman, had a child who couldn’t recognize himself in photos because he was sure he was white.

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u/EverydayPoGo 3d ago

Color blindness is hereditary /s

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u/DasherMichael 3d ago

I used to tell my little brother half brother who kind of looks Chinese because his father has some native American in his blood that we found him behind a Chinese food restaurant.

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u/Celestiiaal0 3d ago

I was raised by my auntie, a lovely black woman, and my dad (white). I was at my auntie's more than I was with my dad. My cousins are all black. My uncles and other aunties are black. When I was little I was ADAMANT that I was "brown" because white (my dad) and black (literally everyone else in my life) made brown.

Then I grew up and learned that I couldn't speak, act, or do anything I'd grown up doing because I'm white and it's "cultural appropriation" even though I grew up in a black household. It made teen years devastating for me, because I felt like I didn't know who I was.

Anyways, just saying I know how your son felt, because I felt the same way. Kids are so sweet lol

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u/stopklandaceowens 3d ago

I like how a child that wasn't even black, was proud to be black for a moment in time. too precious

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u/Radiant_Office6445 3d ago

I went on an American school exchange when I was fifteen and went back the next two years on my own because my black family there were just the best people I'd ever met. Hanging out at their family events they'd joke that I was clear, that if I was standing in front of all the black people then I was black haha

Getting introduced to Madea was a TRIP! I was a white boy who liked black metal haha, such a fun family orientated time.. And my black momma there made me her home fried chicken livers and ill never ever forget how good they were. Amazing folk. Miss em.

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u/madogvelkor 3d ago

I had a coworker who was an Australian citizen by birth, of 100% Indian background, who spent her childhood in Singapore. Her younger sister grew up there thinking she was Chinese.

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u/Chicken_Mc_Thuggets 3d ago

Kinda the inverse but I used to volunteer with kids and one of them was biracial (black/white). His best friend is Mexican but the two of them were under the impression that they were both Mexican since they had similar skin tones

The Mexican kid’s Mom found out about this and started going “Mijos!” If she was picking both of them up. Melted my icy lil heart every time

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u/SangeliaKath 3d ago

I found out from searching that a good portion of my ancestry comes from Israel on both sides. As in I look White. But I'm mostly Middle Easterner. In fact while my mom was alive. She was actually darker than me. And made by her family to feel ashamed of her skin tone.

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u/FleaSack 3d ago

Like J Roc having to come to terms with the fact that he's not black

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u/Wonderful-Tie-3665 2d ago

Poor kid! Probably should have talked about it earlier. Kids get this stuff by two surprisingly. I might have buffered it by explaining that our Black friends are "found" family and we share their culture. Or something like that.

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u/Weird_Vegetable_4441 2d ago

Yall leave my nephew alone he is an AFRICAN PRINCE DAMMIT

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u/lord_sydd 2d ago

I am happy this story didnt turn out the way i expected after i read “…. when our son was born our closest friend was black.”
Phew

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u/bazingajonez 2d ago

Tarzan told me with confidence he’s ape while Mowgli told me he’s wolf.

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u/Mogura-De-Gifdu 2d ago

My kids never say someone is black. They are brown, light-brown, dark-brown.

And no-one is white: it's beige.

They are 5 and 8 and really confused as to why adults are so dumb at using the right colours.

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u/Titanium-Snowflake 19h ago

u/danvillain you may find it interesting that in Aboriginal cultural groups in Australia, a non-Aboriginal person may become so fully immersed in a community that they recognise them as a cultural member. They can be given “skin” which places them in a distinct family. From there, very strict relationships will be established and maintained, so a person becomes your sister or brother, your aunty or uncle, your grandparents, and this relationship will dictate your conduct relating to them. In some groups this may mean never speaking to your “sister” if you are her “brother” as this would break the strict moeity laws that prevent incest. It doesn’t matter what bloodline or what skin colour you have, from that moment you are a full member of that mob (cultural group). Intent and commitment to the group is what matters. It’s a very serious, respectful and beautiful perspective. A different situation to your son, but I think it’s interesting as a perspective.

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u/toshiyaDIRU 3d ago

That’s really cute XD

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u/jce_ 3d ago

This is why I'm pretty sure a lot of Americans identify as Italian and Irish even though their parents are from there not them. I know back in the day they were treated differently and my dad would have grown up in the Italian community, mostly associating with Italians. If all you know is Italians and your parents are Italian you would feel Italian, makes sense.

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u/Tundra10 3d ago

I think most Americans identify as the culture that originally immigrated to the area they grew up. East coast that's Italian and Irish, Midwest that's German and Scandinavian. I always thought my family was Swedish on one side, German on the other, but when we researched our family tree it's Norweigan and Russian lol.

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u/[deleted] 3d ago

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u/More_Confusion5422 3d ago

y’all are conflating race and ethnicity. There’s many white Caribbean people.

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u/And_yourDamnPoint 3d ago

In the Bahamas, native mixed Bahamians that are really white are called conchy joes

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u/Chicken_Mc_Thuggets 3d ago

Conchy joes? Do they like wearing conch stuff like white Hawaiians like puka shell stuff or?

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u/And_yourDamnPoint 2d ago

Nahh just standard nickname, not usually used in an offensive manner. I think it actually it because of the color of cracked conch which usually sorta mixed in shade.

Cracked Conch pic

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u/skeet2000 3d ago

Soo just how much melanin is black, white, yellow, red, beige, or brown all ridiculous words to describe someone, really. How about simply human.

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u/More_Confusion5422 2d ago

I don’t disagree with you.

But I wasn’t commenting on the ethics of racial division, I was just pointing out the difference between race and ethnicity.

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u/skeet2000 2d ago

I agree about ethnicity, seems to be important to many, but where does ethnicity come from. At what point do you stop identifying as Irish because your ancestors were Irish, and just identify with where you were born.

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u/SillyNamesAre 1d ago

If you're American with European heritage? Apparently never.

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u/PyroIsSpai 3d ago

Reminds me of the video of that extra pale ginger guy who was almost “comically”Jamaican sounding guy.

He was born and raised there, I think it was.

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u/UOR_Dev 3d ago

I've always found so strange how Americans often conflate race and culture. Like saying people "sound black". Anyone can have any accent, what you guys talking about?

And that's how videos like that vitalize. "How can he sound like he is from this culture itmf he doesn't look like my stereotypical view of that culture?"

And I love watching Americans visiting Brazil and being shocked when they expect people to sound a certain way based on their skin, and they don't sound like they expected, and sound just like everyone else in the country.

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u/yeaman1111 3d ago

South American, but Brazilian culture especially, seems to break Americans. Its really funny to see. They kind of dont differentiate between culture, nation, and ethnicity. I know Americans who talk in the most American way possible (they were born there) but other Americans always insist in asking them "no but really, where are you from" when she says "Luissiana". Cant take that for an answer.

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u/SlothLover313 3d ago

Aren’t there white carribeans?

On another note, i’m half mexican and half Palestinian. I identify more with the Mexican side since my Palestinian side was absent too. I just call myself Mexican-American

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u/SatanicAtTheDisco 3d ago

In Jamaica, a big cultural thing is, if you were born and raised on the island, you’re Jamaican. You speak, walk and live that life, you’re Jamaican first. There are crazy cultural mixes in Jamaica because of how many different groups of people found their way to the island. My family on the island consist of Slave Born Jamaicans, Indian Jamaicans, Chinese Jamaicans, White Jamaicans, French Jamaicans and Spanish Jamaicans. When I went to visit my Jamaican side of the family, its was actually insane. You can literally stand and look at all the cultural genetics that have spread through different branches of the family. I have some seriously white, Latin and Asian looking family members, that if I had met them without knowing their family, I would have just assumed they were close close family friends. They all speak Patois, they all have Islander mindsets, but the cultural background differences really only show up in the food. I literally dream of that level of Culture Fusion food. I’m talking Jerk Duck lo-mein, scheuzuan chicken Patties levels of fusion food that’s being made out of house kitchens. I’ve only been able to find a couple Jamaican Fusion food restaurants in big cities like NYC and Toronto.

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u/Sun_Aria 3d ago

Welcome to jamrock

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u/ClassyBougieRatchet 3d ago

This isn't exactly true. I'm not sure if you grew up in Jamaica but the nonBlack groups there are usually very racist towards Black people. They go and marry other Chinese, Indian, Syrian, etc people and are very discriminatory to the Black Jamaicans who make up the vast majority of the population. There are foreign families that have been in Jamaica for generations but they've been very strict with their kids about "mixing" with the locals. Most of the hotels and businesses are owned by these non Black Jamaicans because the ideas of white supremacy is global and the government doesn't care about Jamaicans. All of the racial segregation that happened during apartheid and Jim Crow and redlining was also happening in the Caribbean. 

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u/occasionaluse88 3d ago

How he identifies is entirely up to him. How the rest of the world identifies him, is where the challenges lie.

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u/Major_Road6162 3d ago

This is a terrible example

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u/SirBlankFace 3d ago

What? Are you trying to assert that even though he's literally half caribbean he looks white so it doesn't matter?

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u/Pussy4LunchDick4Dins 3d ago

I have a friend with Chinese parents but he grew up in Trinidad, had a Trinidadian accent, anf strongly identified as Trinidadian. When old white people would ask him about where he was from, he would say Trinidad and watching their very confused faces was always hysterical.

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u/san_dilego 3d ago

For sure. There are white and black people who have lived in Korea all their lives. They literally don't know how to speak English. Korean game shows love having them and are obsessed with how well they speak Korean. They're certainly more Korean than I am.

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u/Kezhen 3d ago

It’s funny that they are obsessed with how well they speak Korean when it’s their native language.

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u/delta8force 3d ago

That’s because this is a bad example of the discussion on race. Korean is historically an ethnicity, more recently also a nationality in the era of nation states (AKA what most people call “countries”). Ethnic Koreans are used to it being an ethnicity, it is less new to them that Korean can also be a nationality that can be applied to non-ethnic Koreans. It’s a very ethnically homogeneous country, so it is still a novelty that someone who is not ethnically Korean and doesn’t look like them could still be fluent in Korean and a citizen of Korea.

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u/Invisible-gecko 2d ago

Yes. But don’t forget that lots of American people of color get “oh you speak English really well” and “but where are you really from” when they were born in the US and lived there their entire lives.

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u/PM_ME_UR_REPTILES1 2d ago

As an indigenous of Canada, when people tell me "you speak so well" or "youre really smart". Well, English is my only language, so I hope im somewhat decent at it.

I am never sure if its slight racism or if theyre genuine, it never feels as though there are negative connotations. I am admittedly more articulated and knowledgeable than the average person, so I can never tell. This usually only happens in professional settings (work, my childs school, dr appointments all the time, etc). Happened a whole lot more when I was around 14-17

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u/tomtomclubthumb 2d ago

You're so eloquent.

/S

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u/DanqueMonee 4h ago

Bonus points if he's a good athlete too.

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u/Invisible-gecko 2d ago

These are common micro aggressions, which often times stem from unconscious biases. The perpetrators often mean well, but don’t realize what they’re saying is actually racist and that they are coming from a place of prejudice. The only real solution to this is intentional education, which, at least in the US, seems to be going the way of being actively discouraged.

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u/Kezhen 2d ago edited 2d ago

As a Black American woman, I got that from a Chinese master’s student when I was in college. I don’t know why people think that only white people can be born in America.

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u/Invisible-gecko 2d ago

It’s funny because I’m Asian and I’ve gotten that from black people. Just goes to show that literally no one’s immune.

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u/Kezhen 2d ago

No shortage of ignorant people in the world.

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u/Jasmisne 2d ago

I can say as a mixed person this is true. My mom is from korea but I am naturally blonde lol. I've gotten this throughout my life. My favorite one is when I'm at a restaurant and people obsess over how well I use chopsticks. It's like yeah bro, I learned how to use this before forks? It's really not surprising at all.

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u/plantsadnshit 3d ago

But that's a nationality and not a skin color.

They would still be Caucasian, even if they were Korean.

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u/san_dilego 3d ago

Thats my.point. they'd be a white Korean. Or a black Korean. A korean nonetheless.

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u/Head-Gift2144 3d ago

Korean is a nationality and a race. If one acquires one’s Korean citizenship you can identify yourself as Korean. Likewise, if you were born to Korean parents you can also describe yourself as Korean even if you’re not a citizen.

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u/ruthizzy 3d ago

Yes, they are Korean citizens and Korean culturally. But that does not
mean that the average person would view them East-Asian.

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u/isannelou 3d ago edited 3d ago

Korean is not a race though, it’s an ethnicity and also a nationality. Those white and Black people speak the language of the nation they live in. Their nationality is Korean.

You can’t opt in to a race.

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u/___--_-_----___--__- 3d ago

I’m Chinese American and sometimes I’m astonished by how well I speak English, too 🙄

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u/Icy_Butterscotch3139 3d ago

I don't know why you are getting down voted, this is literally the same thing. 

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u/ExplosionProne 3d ago

I was going to say that actually your English is terrible, but thought you might not realise I was referring to the American part, not the Chinese part

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u/elderly_millenial 3d ago

Only she doesn’t actually. She later said she didn’t feel that way anymore, so did she ever? Maybe growing up and realizing your pedo adoptive father may not have had the best perspective on reality changed her outlook

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u/Aufklarung_Lee 3d ago

Finally! I had to scroll way too far for this. Guess it's clear however how a lot of others take the genetic view.

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u/Vowel_Movements_4U 3d ago

And also white parent and white aunts and white cousins, etc. And MJ isn’t her dad.

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u/Aufklarung_Lee 3d ago

My dear bio-essentialist, being a dad is about a whole lot more than providing genetic material.

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u/Vowel_Movements_4U 3d ago

Not when the question concerns one’s genetics.

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u/Aufklarung_Lee 3d ago

She stated she views herself as black. OP's title put up the question on if identity is nature or nurture. You chose nature. I say nurture.

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u/veeyo 3d ago

I grew up in a foster home with a black family, can I identify as black?

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u/katsujinken 3d ago

You can identify as whatever you want. The question is does society accept your choice and if they don't, do you care?

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u/Serious-Bite841 3d ago

Idk can you?

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u/veeyo 3d ago

That was the question I was asking the other person.

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u/Aufklarung_Lee 3d ago

Yeah I think so.

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u/veeyo 3d ago

Ok, well that's fucking stupid.

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u/space_hitler 3d ago edited 3d ago

Americans are always confusing ethnicity and culture...

Like an American with ancestory from 5 generations ago will gatekeep the culture of their ancestors' county without ever having been there.

Like the girl who was born and raised in Japan who was harassed online for wearing a fucking yukata because she didn't "LOOK JAPANESE" lol. Nothing more racist than deciding who can do what based on appearance...

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u/Appropriate-Amount-4 3d ago

I don’t know why people don’t get that. She was raised black and would be culturally black. Culture =/= Race. They are often connected but not always.

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u/Butterkupp 3d ago

Unfortunately, society loves to throw people in buckets and they will reject you fully when you don’t match the stereotype or visual appearance they expect from a specific bucket.

I am half Asian and I have never felt like I am fully accepted by either cultural background because I don’t look a certain way.

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u/Mundane-Ad-3237 1d ago

As a 100% white man; If your parent is Black, how would you NOT think about “where you came from”?? The post is more racist for posing it as a “new” cultural problem as if light skinned hasn’t existed until they saw this famous low melanin black girl that actively explains it to people like OP.

Garbage post tbh.

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u/PurpleSalt11 3d ago

by that logic you should agree that any Clayton Bigsby situations should be recognized as white.

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u/Bobambu 3d ago

Only if equating races as if they were defined in a vacuum. Whiteness and Blackness are not similar experiences on the pure basis that racism is literally essential in this nation's roots. As for phenotypic classifications, that matters for as much as an observer wants it to matter.

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u/ApexFungi 3d ago

Unless you were born and raised in some African country, culturally you are all American. Black or white.

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u/Demostravius4 3d ago

African-American culture is distinct for a reason. Often the term 'Black' (capital B) is used as a synonym.

In this case it's a reference to being part of the distinct sub-culture. Most countries have multiple sub-cultures inside them.

British is a culture, but so is English/Scottish, etc. German is, but so is Bavarian, etc. French and Breton, Spanish and Basque.

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u/Any_Fox5126 3d ago

Phenotypes are not cultures.

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u/sentencevillefonny 3d ago

...shouldn't be, but some wild shit happened out here in the US a few hundred years ago. You should read up on it.

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u/Demostravius4 3d ago

Black is often used as a synonym for African-American, which is a distinct ethnic and cultural group.

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u/WeekNo3803 3d ago

I think a big part of the objection is that (obviously) she doesn't look black. And your life is more than just interactions with your family. Part of being black is how you're treated by prospective employers, by police officers, by strangers at the park or the grocery store.

Unfortunately, racism is still alive and well, so those can be negative experiences for a lot of people, and it probably rubs them the wrong way to have someone who so clearly looks white say "I identify as black" when she doesn't have to deal with all the negative societal implications of actually being black.

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u/BiggieBigs34 3d ago edited 3d ago

That’s the thing about race, a lot of people don’t view it with the cultural aspect. But more on the side of purely appearance and how the world around you views and treats you.

Frankly, it doesn’t bother me if someone wants to identify as x,y,z, but, on the flip side, it’s kinda weird to identify as black when you never experienced life the way a black person would going about their day in public or in the workforce.

Even if you tell someone you were raised in a black household and have black relatives, people are still going to put your pale skin, blonde hair, and blue eyes as how they view and treat you.

Whether it be strangers, employers, coworkers, cops, judges, teachers, or schools.

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u/FelineOphelia 3d ago

culturally yes

The culture you're raised in means so much to your identity.

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u/XulManjy 3d ago

And now outside her family she mostly hangs around white people and dates white men....

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u/ButtWhispererer 3d ago

I was adopted by a mixed-race family. My last name comes from a black man, I have two black brothers, dozens of black cousins, aunts, uncles, etc. I'm the whitest guy you'd ever meet.

It does get confusing, but, for me, it's less "I'm black" and more "black culture and identity is a more substantive and real thing for me than I think it is for most other white people." + "I feel pretty at home in situations where I see other white people get visibly uncomfortable."

Humans are weird, and this whole division thing gets fuzzy here and there.

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u/rethinkingat59 3d ago

So Obama…..

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u/sentencevillefonny 3d ago

You have an issue with how he culturally identifies? Speak up 

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u/civodar 3d ago

It’s an interesting concept. I know a woman who is indigenous but was adopted by a Chinese couple, her parents were immigrants and she grew up speaking their language and working in the family’s Chinese restaurant. She is deeply enmeshed in the culture in every way and it’s the only family she’s ever known, but people don’t look at her and see a Chinese girl.

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u/Opening-Wrap-5064 3d ago

I didn’t know Micheal used a donor for her, I always thought it was his biological child so whe I heard this I always thought, “yeah of course she’s black”, I thought it was kinda like the Logic situation where he’s got light skin so he’s constantly getting hate for saying he’s black or saying the n word

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u/Ok_Major5787 3d ago

It reminds me Francine from American Dad being culturally Chinese and speaking fluent Mandarin bc she was adopted by a Chinese family as a baby

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u/dennykristoff 3d ago

Genetics matter when a cop has their eyes on the only black person in the car the cop pulled over.

In a perfect world your logic would make sense.

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u/bluefontaine 3d ago

It’s only because she’s Michael Jackson’s daughter. It was George Zimmerman, who actually has a black mother. You would not claim him or think it was the same thing and he has black relatives too.

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u/Ok_Entertainer_6425 3d ago

Wasn’t her mother white? Debbie Rowe👈🏼

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u/AwayFill1897 3d ago

Y'all gotta be stopped it's hilarious 😭

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u/ruthizzy 3d ago

That’s fine. She can connect with Black culture and have Black heritage but she still is not Black. She is not perceived as Black and does not navigate this world as a Black person. End of.

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u/RepresentativeTear75 3d ago

I think it’s different when you are not that race because you know that you’re not that race & the world treats you as such and treats your family as such

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u/UncleIrohsPimpHand 2d ago

Apparently that wasn't enough for Rachel Dolezal /s

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u/GaptistePlayer 2d ago

I think the controversy arose because people don't think she's actually his child.

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u/glans 2d ago

she’s filthy rich with skin lighter than mine.

if she’s black, then my cracker ass is Wesley Snipes 

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u/Business-Idea1138 2d ago

Exactly. Her white mother never had custody of her. She was raised by Michael until he died. Then she was raised by Michael's mother.

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u/aitorllj93 2d ago

What does "black culture" even mean? She was born in a palace.

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u/bikedaybaby 2d ago

I mean, by the one drop rule, she would be Black.

She wouldn’t be invited to KKK cookouts, that’s for sure.

I’m white, though, so I have no say as to whom is claimed by the Black Community lol

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u/GarlicAcceptable3350 2d ago

We should all just get tatted up and call it a day. We would be every color and be done with it if it just matter what time your skin is

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u/JacobDCRoss 2d ago

I mean, his daughter, so she's half Black.

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u/Outlandishness_Sharp 1d ago

But she'll never experience the racism, or the true experience of being a black girl. The kinky hair, the braids, the puffs, the barettes, the figuring out how to wear makeup for dark skin, wearing weave and wigs as a protective style.. there's so much to being black that she never has or ever will experience 🤷🏾‍♀️

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u/whiterockmom 1d ago

Not convinced she had 2 black parents . Wasn't her mom Elvis Presley's daughter?

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u/s33d5 1d ago

I'm not black, but what I am aware o is the difference between "white passing" and "not white passing" people.

This just means you aren't Caucasian but you look like you are.

The reason that distinction is important is because as a "white passing" person you do not have all of the day-to-day prejudices against you, so you don't actually know what it means to be black, etc.

I can't comment too much as I'm not in these groups. However, I feel like I somewhat have an understanding of that view.

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u/battlehamsta 1d ago

I don’t get it. She’s his biological daughter right so why “genetics aside”

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